Denied a request from David J. Peterson for a taxicab/limousine owner's license. Police Chief Rob Copley recommended denial based on the results of a background check. He also said Peterson does not have a permanent address in the city. During a public hearing in November, several representatives from other taxicab/shuttle services said they felt there is not enough business in town to support an additional service.
OK...This burns my ass.
1st. Has anyone read the city code on taxi service ?? It's 12 pages long !! WTF ?? The only thing that this guy didn't have to submit to City Council is a sperm sample !! This is WAY too much for a simple taxi service. Here is Springfield IL Taxicab operator's license and registration. Here is Rock Island city Code. Seem like they are more inviting to a new taxi business.
2. A check with the circuit clerks page shows only one David J. Peterson and has 1 citation. And it's for animal at large ??? Don't seem like a felon to me...
3. "Peterson does not have a permanent address in the city" ?? When did business owners have to live within the city ???? Must of missed this one. Wal-Mart, Sears, K-mart, pack up, you guys are out of here !!
4. "several representatives from other taxicab/shuttle services said they felt there is not enough business in town to support an additional service" Really ??? If you asked current retail stores if Quincy really needs a Sam's store and you'll get the same response. Is this the way we want to regulate business in the city ??? Hope not.
This city could use another taxi service and if there is not enough service..? Let the free enterprise system work. I will have to say, seeing that the QPD is hammering DUI's in this city and when another cab company tries to start up and the Police Chief denies it, it looks bad.
What has this city done to free enterprise ???
Definition:
Business governed by the laws of supply and demand, not restrained by government interference, regulation or subsidy. also called free market.
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44 comments:
The City Government is PRO MONOPOLY !
I used to type words like "Spring is doing a good"
Those words will never be typed by me again .
Our CITY workers take up more space on ACCC site . There are thefts, intent to deliever, batterys etc etc etc ... Hell our QPD guys aren't any angels come to think of it .
Thanks for the link...it was quite the read. Some highlights:
No rockets in Quincy.
No telling of fortunes.
Playing the lottery is illegal.
No bathing in the river.
No defacing of any sort of telegraph apparatus.
You cannot injure a shrub.
No yelling.
No showing of the female breast, with anything less than a fully opaque covering, starting at a point above the areola.
Quincy rules!
Great post, Fire! Anyone, what, if anything, is the skeleton in the Peterson guy's closet that he can't run a freakin taxi service?
Do you have to tour with "Up With People" in order to shuttle drunks?
Another taxi service is sorely, sorely NEEDED in this town. Copely screws the pooch again, at our expense.
You heard the MST guy say that the drunks will end on the roads. Let's keep on this one folks, this is 100% BS, anyone in the know, please respond!
Again, great post, Fire! You kick the HW's ass anyday!
Doesn't look to me like anyone from the city said anything about market factors or what another operator would do to business. Looks to me like that was all vested interests, looking to maintain a market share. Fire seems to pride itself on being a "down the middle" straight shooter. Seems to me to be less than fair to attribute such an argument to the city.
On the issue of character and fitness generally for any application for a privilege license, Doncha suppose QPD might have access to better criminal history information than the local Circuit Clerk's website? Doncha suppose that some criminal activity takes place beyond the corporate boundaries of Adams County?
As the redoubtable Jerry Leggett used to say, "Everybody here is better at my job than me."
I agree with the first comment, but I would state it as the city goverment "Sucks" and to make matters worse I hear David Nuessen is planning on running again for mayor, Just what the republican party needs. Can elephants run?????????
I agree with the first comment. If the city goverment was a business it would go bust in a week. It hasn't had a pro business creative idea in 30 years. As to umrblog stating the QPD probably has more criminal information than what appears at the circuit clerk's office, I wonder if they can factually tell us how many traffic stops have been made on QPD staff and no ticket written in the past year. Or better yet, just how many tickets have been issued to QPD officers in the past three years.
Curious minds just want to know!!!
umrblog:
Thanks. In fact I do pride myself on being "down the middle". I just like to see some answers to questions that are left unanswered.
If I can use a page out of your book and say " read it again", I ask "Is this the way we want to regulate business in the city ???"
According to City Code (and I know you know it) it states:
Upon receipt of an application for a taxicab owner's license, the chief of police, or his designate, is authorized, empowered, and directed to hols a public hearing thereon.
I never said anyone from the city said anything about market factors. This is done by the city code. The city REQUIRES this. If you read the code, they don't HAVE to say anything. Let the competing cab companys complain and assume no blame.
I just think, on the 3 reasons stated: Background check, city address, and lack of rival cab company support...thats pretty weak for allowing a new business to start.
but hey, Thanks for stopping by !!
umrblog:
Looking at the city code, I looks like it's easier to become a city police officer than start a taxi company. True ??
Let's explore the edges of that. Are you arguing that transportation for hire in the city shouldn't be a regulated, licensed industry? Or are you just saying the standards should be lower? Or are you saying that this particular decision was wrong?
Without regard to this decision, I feel pretty good about the idea that the service which will haul a lot of blind and enderly people be populated and operated by people of reasonably good and honest character.
Background check is a "weak" reason? I just don't know how you can make that statement without knowing what it turned up.
You probably already know there are legal limits to what a law enforcement agency can do with criminal history information.
1303,
Two answers. First, take the tests and let me know what you think. Second, I assure you the level of background check for an incoming officer is more than a bit more thorough than a guy who wants a privilege license in the city.
12 PAGES? UMR must have written it.
He seems to be taking it alittle too personally.
Are you arguing that transportation for hire in the city shouldn't be a regulated, licensed industry? Or are you just saying the standards should be lower? Or are you saying that this particular decision was wrong?
Why is Quincy's standard stronger than RI or SPFLD ???
Background check is a "weak" reason?
Do ALL business owner in the city of Quincy get background checks ??
I think not.
umrblog:
privilege license ??
It's a taxi service not the secret service.
...and read on. The city reserves the right to revoke their licence at any given time.
So what is really the risk ???
UMR:
You make a strong point about the background check, but what about the city address ?? Is that not weak ?? Is it required to live in the city also ? Also about the competing cab companys despute ? Is that not weak also ?
You jump Fire's ass on one point, but there was 3 given. Explain the other two please...
I'm sure Kriegers was happy that Fridays moved in. Is that market oversaturated, or what? Where was Copely when they put in 3 sonics that all went bust?
QPD gave my friends from St. Louis a ride home from Maine St. late one night last January, they couldn't believe Qcy had no cab service (and still don't) after 1 a.m. The QPD officer was nice and gave them a ride home, but is that what QPD is for?
For God's sake, let the guy start his cab company, it is greatly needed. Copely should pin a medal on the guy for even thinkin about it, was very civic minded.
You wanna talk backgrounds! The news had felony charged J. Jansen, who runs a nightclub, talking bout drunks ending up BTW on the steets! Why is this person with his record allowed to get people drunk & potentially dangerous, then you scrutinize the background owner of the prospective cab company that would only help the situation (in regards to safety)?
Honestly, we have problem in this town, from 1 a.m. to 3:00 a.m., we have hundreds of drunks driving around, going to differant bars, or home from bars. And no cabs run at those hours. You all know it's true. And someone wants to start a cab compnay that maybe would run in those time periods, and Copely wants to stand in the way? Great job, Copely, just please pray you or I don't get smacked by a drunk driver at that instead could have been in a cab owned by Mr. Bad Background Lives in the Boonies Black-Balled By the OLD Boys Cab Co's Assoc.
We need to get the state or the feds in on this one, someone with some sense, at least. It is that important.
I would LOVE to see a Fed like Fitzgerald come into this area . It would make Chicago look like BUSH LEAGUE play.
Umrblog:
No. Let’s go right down the middle. Should the transportation for hire be regulated licensed industry? Yes it is, by the State of Illinois. No person shall drive any motor vehicle upon a highway in this State unless such person has a valid license or permit. Also No person shall operate, register or maintain registration of, and no owner shall permit another person to operate, register or maintain registration of, a motor vehicle designed to be used on a public highway unless the motor vehicle is covered by a liability insurance policy. For hire codes….way too long for here.(IL DMV Vehicle Code)
Standards be lower? Let the DMV do there job. The “requirements” the city has set .. Yes, they seem to me, to be wrong. Free enterprise should be allowed here and if they follow the rules…fine. If not, then looks like it’s going to fold. I could care less if Ricky Bobby OWNED the service, the drivers are the ones who will haul a lot of these so called blind and elderly people around. Like a earlier post, It’s a cab service, not the secret service.
Now…..for the points you didn’t hit. Should it be a requirement for every business OWNER to have a permanent Quincy address?? That’s what the paper read and it was one of the three reasons this person was denied to operate a taxi service in the city…..Why was this?
#2 Why is it required to have a public hearing by the chief of police on whether this business should be allowed to operate in the city of Quincy? The only people I bet who showed up were the competing cab companies and I bet it wasn’t in support either. This is written into the city code and I’m sure me and a sh*tload of other would like an answer on this one.
Think I had some support from some ANON’s on the rest of the subject.
Angry Mob,
I was about 12 when this ordinance was written so I have no pride of authorship.
Don't comment on individual city cases or issues because of professional constraints but the general points are useful.
Hypothetically, if an applicant has a number of felony convictions or a number of other crimes involving dishonesty, it's fair to believe he will not keep straight maintenance and service records. It's rational to believe he will not adequately screen employees or plate the vehicles he says are in his fleet (fly by night operators love to have about ten vehicles and about five plates. On your lucky night, you might actually be riding in vehicles that's truly insured). A lot of criminals have been caught by cooperation with upstanding cab companies. It's reasonable to be concerned that a criminal type would not help in a criminal investigation or that he would cover up a crime committed by one of his employees (fast changing disabled passenger, for example.) It's real cute to say "It's not the secret service." but running a cab company is a position of public trust.
The market thing is a legislative determination. It's in the public interest to have a cab service and the destruction of healthy companies by either rate cutting or unsafe practices could leave the public with no service. I don't love this theory but some city council, some day found it constructive. Chicago goes at it from the other end and regulates on threshold price of permits and rate regulation (same result, there is really no private market determination) just different method.
Address thing is much of a rationale but, once the applicant is out for character, it is also just a detail. The argument would be location of a responsible person in case of emergency or upset condition or civil emergency. Probably as long as there was a manger available locally, this one wouldn't have to be a deal breaker.
The "free market" is not universal. Some industries, from nuclear reactors to spud farmers to natural gas transporters have been subjected legislatively to simultaneous protection from some level of competition and close regulatory examination.
If you don't think cab companies should be one of them, sell it to your alderman. As guys get out of prison, it'll become a new career track for them.
Just to repeat, I can't talk about specific cases but I think this is an interesting journey into the law school course called "Regulated Industries." (to which your first thought is always "That's UnAmerican."
Thanks for the focus on a worthwhile topic.
1600,
I think you are onto something here. Before a privilege license is given, the counsel should a designated representative of the "Night Drunks Association" give a Victim Impact Statement!
Of course, then we'd have to have a presentation from the King of AA and that would p!ss off Addicts Victorious, so they'd get equal time. Then the barkeeps' guild would put in a request, followed by the beer wholesalers. Somehow that would provoke the Health Department into action and.....well, you get the idea. All the due process we could stand.
Maybe you can "sell it to Spring's 9 rubber stamps " for us . The words Sell it to your aldermen have never rung so Hollow .
But I did snicker when an Alderman told me how they "got $250,000 over 5 years for the city"
Yes He sure did do that . Like he did it for the past 15 . And like he did the math of spend $700,000 for $50,000 is the "best deal for the tax payer"
rumor has it that the city has a "deal" with the cab company that they are the only "one" in town??
One cab company + services stop at 1am =more DUI's + more income for QPD.
Two cab companys = rival & lower rates, better service, less DUI's= loss of income for city.
umrblog: do the math.
How the hell can you relate a service that protects the President and Vice President, their families, heads of state, and other designated individuals with their life to a person that which conveys passengers between locations of their choice is beyond me.
Public trust is one thing but this?
NOT
The taxi industry is one of the most highly regulated industries on the local level. While many taxicab regulations were instituted as an attempt to improve service quality, the historical legacy has been lower service quality and industry competitiveness. This occurs because local regulations create substantial barriers to entry that protect a small number of established firms (creating an "oligopoly"). Many of these barriers have little impact on service quality and create inefficiencies in the taxicab industry, reducing profitability and competitiveness. Furthermore, regulations that prevent new firms from entering a market severely limit business ownership opportunities in the industry, particularly for low income and minority populations.
Public hearings on new cab company applications
Public hearings should be reserved for deliberating regulatory policy rather than performing routine, administrative functions and micromanaging an industry. Quincy's ordinance is unduly open on public hearings, allowing virtually anyone to object to a new applicant irrespective of conflicts of interest and tangible impacts by the proposed business. Criteria granting licenses should be clear and objective, enabling taxicab licenses to be processed administratively. Criteria for approval should be limited to performance issues directly tied to the quality of service provided. This minimizes the likelihood licenses will be approved or rejected for political reasons.
Spin Master:
The day I see a man of Middle Eastern descent wearing a turbin in a presidential motorcade I’ll admit you are correct. Until then, not gonna buy it.
You can spin this any way you please.
Quincy needs something after 1:00AM, It's not that hard people! Copley and whoever else involved get your head out of your ass. Has anybody seen the crowd that leaves Main Street Tap @ 3:00AM. I wouldn't want to and, I sure don't want to pass them on the street. God forbid I am even out at 3:00AM. So SPIN Master SHUT UP!!!
I have to agree with whoever it was that said the owner of a cab company should not receive a license if he or she has a number of felony convictions for theft and other such offenses involving dishonesty. I would be willing to bet that if the results of the background check were made public there would be such a history for the applicant and that was the real reason the application was denied.
I believe Quincy does need a late night cab service. Hopefully some qualified applicant will step forward and begin such business.
However, here is something to think about. If there is such a need and money could be made providing the service, why hasn't the current cab company stepped forward and run the service late at night?
806
..or, if you're going to protect one company by making the barrier to entry so high, make them do it. Many cities have a 24/7 requirement.
Supply Sider 1819,
That's a fair argument and the free market approach was tried in Phoenix in 1980's with unpleasant results for customers. It could be different now because we're in the information age.
The second part of your argument baffles me. How does a good character requirement disadvantage minority applicants?
1204,
Are you talking to Dec. 13 @ 1443? The "secret service" straw man didn't come from me.
1114
It doesn't.
Ok, even if the guy lives in a van down by the river & pulled a few tags off of mattresses, let eem open up his cab co if he will run after 1:00 a.m. and help us ALL out! People change, I know old age cured me of most of may bad habits, maybe him too! LOL
Let's give the guy a chance to better himself if he wants to open up a very needed cab co! Keep a good eye on him, if you have to. Maybe give him a probationary license/permit? Heck, maybe the city could subsidize him if he's keeping drunks off the road, that way he could be closely monitored, if he were getting govt money! We pay for verything else, don't we!
1114
I was speaking to licensing fees as one of the barriers, not necessarily here, although I don't know the fee.
In cities such as New York, a medallion costs about $150,000. What is it here?
A lot of criminals have been caught by cooperation with upstanding cab companies.
Really? How many here in Quincy?
Ever take a cab in Chicago? I'm sure Akmed or Abdul are real upstanding citizens! They have a lot more to worry about up there, anyway! They drive like suicide pilots, but I guess they have too, up there.
1554,
I can think of two killers and rapist right off the top of my head. The most dramatic was probably December 27, 1981. That guy was still armed. I was in the comm center as it went down and the officer was (and is) a good friend of mine.
It's not something the operators want a big attaboy for but it has been part of the police-cab relationship.
Really? Three in nearly thirty years?
I'm not saying they aren't helpful, but I doubt the police-cab relationship is any different than the police-OTR driver relationship or the police-lion tamer relationship. Unless you have information that says that Quincy cab drivers have assisted in solving more crimes than any other profession.
3:54 To answer your question,
One crook, Bucky Batchhelder
was caught by a cab driver.
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